Talk:Load transfer

Hi, Regular.Stormy, good article. Only thing is I am not quite with you what a 'load transfer moment arm' is (5th para). Do you think you could make that a bit plainer for us simple folk? Thanks. Dieter Simon 00:18, 23 Jan 2005 (UTC)

What should this redistribution of normal force due to inertia be called?

I get about equal numbers of Google hits for "load transfer" and "weight transfer" but the first few for "weight transfer" are about car performance, while the first few for "load transfer" are not. So I suggest that this article be merged with "Weight transfer". We still need to say that the main effect is due to inertia but there is some secondary change in the center of gravity. "Load transfer" sounds a bit as though it meant the cargo (people, lugage and gasoline, in a car) shifting.

Anyway, we should keep trying to make it more quickly understandable to a larger readership because that will save lives. Whatever the effect is called, it does kill a lot of people each year. David R. Ingham 19:39, 18 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I've always referred to it as weight transfer, and so does every car enthusiast I've talked to. I've never heard of it being referred to as load transfer before. I did a quick google search and dug this page up which could be of some use: http://www.ozebiz.com.au/racetech/theory/wttrans.html Leedeth 12:47, 29 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

These published references all call it load transfer:

Tyre and Vehicle Dynamics by Hans B. Pacejka
Motorcycle Dynamics by Vittore Cossalter
Motorcycle Handling and Chassis Design by Tony Foale

In fact, Tony Foale is quite explicite:

This is normally referred to as wight transfer, but that is really a misnomer. [long sentence about what weight is] Neither acceleration nor braking can cause this weight to transfer elsewhere. As a result the use of the term 'load transfer' is preferable.

Are there definitive references that call it weight transfer? -AndrewDressel (talk) 14:39, 8 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, Gillespie 'fundamentals of vehicle dynamics'. He calls it weight transfer, and doesn't mention load transfer. I'd say the obvious difference is that gillespie is a car and truck dynamicist, where load transfer is far more important than weight transfer, but we all call it weight transfer, except for the SAE who are up themselves. I agree it is a misnomer, but wiki should represent the real world usage, not pedanticisms, I'd have thunk. Greglocock (talk) 00:35, 9 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Imaginary?

Please explain how load transfer is "imaginary". If it were truly imaginary, why is it even worth discussing? As written, I don't think this subject is really separate from weight transfer. At any rate, it's not using the correct terminology to try to distinguish the two and may reflect a lack of understanding on the part of the author. Ham Pastrami 04:36, 4 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The word "imaginary" has been removed. -AndrewDressel (talk) 14:49, 8 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Merge proposal

It appears that the auto industry (with references) uses weight transfer, while the motorcycle industry (with references) uses load transfer to describe the same phenomona: the measurable change of load borne by different wheels during acceleration. For this reason, we propose the intro paragraph should read something like:

Weight transfer and load transfer are two expressions used somewhat confusingly to describe two distinct effects:^[1] the change in load borne by different wheels of even perfectly rigid vehicles during acceleration, and the change in center of mass (CoM) location relative to the wheels because of suspension complience or cargo shifting or sloshing. In the automobile industry, weight transfer customarily refers to the change in load borne by different wheels during acceleration.^[2] This is more properly referred to as load transfer,^[3] and that is the expression used in the motorcycle industry,^[4] while weight transfer on motorcycles, to a lesser extent on automobiles, and cargo movement on either is due to a change in the CoM location relative to the wheels.

^ Foale, Tony (2006). Motorcycle Handling and Chassis Design (Second ed.). Tony Foale Designs. pp. 9–1. ISBN 978-84-933286-3-4.
^ Gillespie, Thomas D. (1992). Fundamentals of Vehicle Dynamics. SAE International. ISBN 978-1560911999.
^ Pacejka, Hans B. (2006). Tyre and vehicle dynamics (Second ed.). SAE International. pp. 14–15. ISBN 978-0768017021. Retrieved 2009-03-31.
^ Cossalter, Vittore (2006). Motorcycle Dynamics (Second ed.). Lulu.com. pp. 84–85. ISBN 978-1-4303-0861-4.

Comments? -Greglocock (talk) and AndrewDressel (talk) 13:03, 10 August 2009 (UTC),[reply]

[Foale-1] Foale, Tony (2006). Motorcycle Handling and Chassis Design (Second ed.). Tony Foale Designs. pp. 9–1. ISBN 978-84-933286-3-4.

[2] Gillespie, Thomas D. (1992). Fundamentals of Vehicle Dynamics. SAE International. ISBN 978-1560911999.

[3] Pacejka, Hans B. (2006). Tyre and vehicle dynamics (Second ed.). SAE International. pp. 14–15. ISBN 978-0768017021. Retrieved 2009-03-31.

[Cossalter-4] Cossalter, Vittore (2006). Motorcycle Dynamics (Second ed.). Lulu.com. pp. 84–85. ISBN 978-1-4303-0861-4.

[1]

[2]

[3]

[4]