Talk:Sportpalast speech

A fact from this article was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the On this day section on February 18, 2007, February 18, 2008, February 18, 2009, February 18, 2010, February 18, 2012, February 18, 2013, February 18, 2016, February 18, 2018, and February 18, 2021.

Military history: European / German / World War II

This article is within the scope of the Military history WikiProject. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and see a list of open tasks. To use this banner, please see the full instructions.Military historyWikipedia:WikiProject Military historyTemplate:WikiProject Military historymilitary history articles

This article has been checked against the following criteria for B-class status:
Referencing and citation: criterion not met Coverage and accuracy: criterion met Structure: criterion met Grammar and style: criterion met Supporting materials: criterion not met

Associated task forces:
/
	European military history task force
	German military history task force
	World War II task force

Germany High‑importance

	Germany portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Germany, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Germany on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.GermanyWikipedia:WikiProject GermanyTemplate:WikiProject GermanyGermany articles
High	This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.

Untitled

I've simply copied the alleged context from the edit summary. I don't know whether it's accurate, and I don't think the article as it stands should be kept. But I hope this edit might help the possible deletion process. Andrewa 08:52, 18 Mar 2004 (UTC)

The Speech text is now at WIkiSource. I would do an inter-Wiki link, but in truth I do not know how to. Paul, in Saudi 16:43, 25 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Transcription/translation

I think the web sites including the text of this important speech seem to be mis-transcribed — so I suspect a mis-transcription in the German version that's crept into the English transcription.

There is an good quality audio/video excerpt of Goebbels' speech at the German Bundestag (parliament) site:

http://www.bundestag.de/bau_kunst/ausst/wege/katalog/5_1.html

I am not a fluent German speaker, but the part of the speech that's transcribed as

Glaubt ihr mit dem Führer und mit uns an den endgültigen Sieg des deutschen Volkes?

[Do you believe with the Führer and with us in the final victory of the German people?]

I, however, hear the words

Glaubt ihr mit dem Führer und mit uns an den endgültigen Sieg des deutschen Waffen?

[Do you believe with the Führer and with us in the final victory of German weapons?]

See the following, which all give the former transcription (which I think is in error):

The following looks to be the most complete English translation available (most transcriptions in both German and English seem to be excerpts). This version is consistent with the original German given in the other sites but, as with the others, does not match what I hear in the audio clip.

http://www.calvin.edu/academic/cas/gpa/goeb36.htm

(This is an excellent site about German propaganda, by the way.)

Does anyone know any source of the entire speech in audio or video form?

JonRoma 04:43, 19 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Hi JonRoma: You're right, it's correct, the "German weapons" are clearly audible, not people. I detected, however, another mistake in the translation. The very last sentence Goebbels said was "Nun Volk steh auf und Sturm brich los!". That was translated as "Now, nation stand up and LET THE storm break lose". That's wrong. With "...und Sturm brich los!", Goebbels directly addressed the "storm" he hoped for as if he tried to conjure it personally. The correct translation of that last sentence is "Now [German] People, stand up and storm, break lose!" (It's not in this video from your link unfortunately). Btw, I'd like to have the entire sound file too. It would be very interesting. However, it's not availlable probably because of the potential danger of that very strong speech. I'm German myself and I hope to find out more about this speech. I'll be glad to be able to tell you more about it. ;) --Krawunsel 21:07, 25 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Hello Krawunsel, and thank you for your comments about the mistranslation, as well as your additions about Nun Volk steh auf und Sturm brich los! I have always wondered about that phrase, knowing that my skills with the German language are weak and that the meaning of a phrase isn't always conveyed well by a word-for-word translation. I wonder if an English translation that carries the sense of these words would be "Now rise up and break loose the storm!" (We might even say "Now rise up and make all hell break loose!")

I agree with your comments about Goebbels' intending to conjure up the storm through his words. No doubt he wanted the audience to rise up right then and there! Though I despise Nazism and all that it stood for, I would like to see and hear more of this speech and some of Hitler's principal speeches, so I can better understand the power of Hitler's oratory and Goebbels' propaganda; I've read translations of some of the principal speeches in Shirer's books and elsewhere, but I'd like to see and hear their power first-hand. I think it would better help us understand how horrors can arise in civilized lands.

I suspect a great deal of the recordings survive but that they are not readily available in their entirety because of denazification laws in your country, and in my country (the USA) because most here wouldn't benefit from hearing speeches in a language other than our own. Still, I would like to learn from history. — JonRoma 05:54, 26 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

The phrase "Now rise up and break loose the storm!" had important nationalistic historical meaning for Germany. We could digress on this. Andries 18:25, 18 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Well, I added some small but valuable information concerning the audience on the Sportpalast during the speech, found in a credible site about German propaganda. It shows again how Goebbels skills were fundamental for the Nazist to seize and maintain their power over Germany. It's the bit about a carefully selected audience that reacted in a fanatic way so the impact of the speech was even higher. -- Marcos2006 00:56, 25 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The problem is that the printed and the spoken versions are different. The printed versions of the text have "Volk," but Goebbels did, in fact, say "Waffen." I secured the full audio version I used from the German Radio Archive in Wiesbaden. Bytwerk 13:42, 24 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Copyright status

Does anyone know the copyright status of the Sportpalast speech? This may sound like a strange question, but in the case of Mein Kampf, the state of Bavaria seized the copyright and used it to restrict republication. So I wondered who's the copyright owner of Goebbels' most (in-)famous speech - some nation who seized the copyright, some of Goebbels' heirs, or is it in the public domain? I hope that the latter holds, because this would permit translating more of it into English, but I'm not so sure. Aragorn2 15:15, 8 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I previously tried to research this at some point and it does not appear anyone has an active claim on the copyright, but obviously there is no clear resolution of the matter either. Presumably either a distant relative of Goebbels or the German state, or both, could try to claim copyright, but neither appears to have done so. English translations have been published (including online) for many years with no complainant coming forth. Mein Kampf, incidentally, is also not actively copyright-protected in most countries in the world either, since Bavaria's claim is not generally recognized outside Germany. --Delirium 03:02, 18 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

You could argue that this speech is a publication by a German authority, because Goebbels was the propaganda minister when he held it, and given the decoration etc. it was apparently an official event. (Unlike "Mein Kampf" which Hitler wrote well before he seized power.) Then the speech would be in the public domain, see commons:Template:PD-GermanGov. But I am unsure if this interpretation is valid. --史慧开 (talk) 16:43, 18 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

According to german copyright law, the copyright ends 70 years after death of the Author. So you can copy it to Wikisource at 1 of May 2015 (ok-ok, 2-nd of May to be sure). Sheepdog85 (talk) 18:21, 15 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

sources

This article lists no sources. Especially statements like "Goebbels also wanted, by building such huge popular enthusiasm, to convince Hitler to give him greater powers in running the war economy." are in need of a source, otherwise it's just speculation.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.235.31.191 (talk) 23:56, 15 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I think the assertion that foreign sources could tell the audience was handpicked is partly sourced by the Speer quote in the Calvin summary, where Goebbels says it is the best trained audience in all Germany. I suppose one still needs sources that foreign observers at the time said the audience was handpicked. Mavrinan2 (talk) 19:33, 20 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

summary vs detail

I thought the summary had too much detail, so I shortened the summary section and put some of the detail in later sections. The comment that Goebbels moved his hands during the speech as body language is too vague to be meaningful so I removed it. Mavrinan2 (talk) 19:33, 20 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Videos of this speech

These sites: [[1]] and [[2]] have this speech.The first video has a tranlation to English.Agre22 (talk) 00:59, 31 August 2008 (UTC)agre22[reply]

Reception of the speech?

Nowhere in the article was I able to find the true reaction of the german people. Were they pumped or did they just dismiss the message? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Nicbou (talk • contribs) 20:43, 30 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

oh dear, the reaction is awesome: today the speech is used in official german highschool program (in German Literature) as an example of manipulating people by the massmedia. excuse my english btw. Sheepdog85 (talk) 01:27, 5 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

If you didn't show off that you endorsed the ideas expounded in the speech, at that time and place you might be in very serious trouble. But most historians also agree the speech was a technically brilliant propaganda coup in a dangerous situation. 83.254.151.33 (talk) 11:58, 24 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I do not support the ideas of the speach , i welcome the use of the speach in german highschool. Sorry if it sounds a little bit unclearly, because of my poor english. Sheepdog85 (talk) 17:57, 30 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Massmedia

The main propaganda "coup" of the speech is not mentioned in the article. In all the years of hitler regime the propaganda ministry managed to bring the radiorecievers practicly in every house (look Volksempfänger). So one cant get rid of listening to the "beloved fuehrer" and other Partyboses. As the overall military situation gets uglier with every moment, Goebbels starts the attempt to mobilize everyone left for the one last material battle with this speech. The speech was translated live in radio, and that was the point: bacause of the laud ovation of the audience, radio listeners should believe in mass support of the folks the goebbels adresses his speech to (doctors, engeneers, etc.). But in reality the audience sitting in Sportpalast is striktly limited only to members of Nazi-party, only invited members were allowd to come, only "ideologically proof" members were invited. So in radio it looked like Goebels is speaking to a Stadium full of ordinary peaple, but it was a simple lie. Please mention this somehow. P.S.: excuse my english. its not my favorite language. Sheepdog85 (talk) 01:59, 5 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Saul Friedländer & Goebbels's slip of the tongue

Saul Friedländer mentions in his Pulitzer Prize-awarded The Years of Extermination that Goebbels at one point makes a telling slip of the tongue:

Germany in any case has no intention of bowing to this threat, but means to counter it in time and if necessary with the most complete and radical extermi—[correcting himself]—elimination” [Ausrott—Ausschaltung].

I've been wanting to hear this part myself, but haven't found any audio that contains this part. The audio linked on the German page, for instance, completely cut out this paragraph (at about 21:30). Moreover, according to the full text at 1000dokumente.de (a site of the Bavarian State Library) Goebbels never says "Ausrott-Ausschaltung", but "Gegenmaßnahmen" (countermeasures):

Deutschland jedenfalls hat nicht die Absicht, sich dieser Bedrohung zu beugen, sondern vielmehr die, ihr rechtzeitig und wenn nötig mit den radikalsten Gegenmaßnahmen entgegenzutreten.

-- 188.194.109.192 (talk) 02:20, 16 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

The transcript on 1000dokumente is apparently either only an edited version, in which certain spoken phrasings have been replaced, or the original text of the speech to which Goebbels did not 100% adhere. Either way, in this also cut recording (of dubious origin) the relevant part is retained; Goebbels's slip is obviously not as explicit as written by Friedländer, but clear nonetheless: "Ausr… schaltung". -- 131.188.6.21 (talk) 13:29, 16 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Reality

Block evasion by User:HarveyCarter

The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.

It had been a total war from the very beginning due to the Royal Navy's blockade which aimed to starve Germany's civilian population. (ManyMoonsoons (talk) 00:51, 11 September 2018 (UTC))[reply]

@ManyMoonsoons: do you understand that this is not a forum where editors can discuss their opinions of WWII? Or even of the speech? It's pretty clear that even if you could find reliable sources backing your belief, it still wouldn't fit here unless you had reliable sources linking your belief to this speech. Doug Weller talk 12:04, 11 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I am just saying the article should point out that it was already a total war before Goebbels made this speech. (ManyMoonsoons (talk) 12:42, 11 September 2018 (UTC))[reply]

Germany had whole continent upon which to draw food from. The fact that few countries wanted to supply a nation that had invaded numerous countries without provocation was not Britain's fault.

Germany was in no way dependent on her shipping for food, Britain OTOH was, and she had suffered 'total war' via the sinking of her merchant shipping since 1939 and was to continue to do so until May 1945.

BTW, the RN blockade didn't apply to neutral ships carrying food to Germany, which were stopped, inspected, and if not carrying war materials, allowed to proceed.— Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.149.173.73 (talk) 11:38, 6 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Ausrottung

Hi, This is translated as extermination in Details and eradication in Quotes; perhaps one could be settled on, for consistency. Jontel (talk) 05:43, 18 February 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Both words "ausrottung" and "ausschaltung" start with a strong auss pronunciation. In this case it seems Goebbels says "aussr..chaltung" — Preceding unsigned comment added by Absu9o (talk • contribs) 03:58, 24 January 2022 (UTC)[reply]